Tag: john winchester

goyour-own-way:

electric-sympathy:

Quick reminder, to the WRITERS IN PARTICULAR, that unless Toni was somehow fucking bugging all the Winchesters’ motel rooms, apartments, the Impala, all the paranoid and now-dead hunters’ places they stayed at, etc., she has no fucking idea what Sam and Dean’s childhood was actually like, what John was like behind closed doors. That in of itself is horrendously bad writing, but now for canon–

The man didn’t go on “drunken rages”. Dean literally told a story in 10×09 about how when he ran off to get drunk with his buddies, John went after him and brought him home. When Dean said he hated him because he embarrassed him, John said, “You don’t like me? That’s fine. It’s not my job to be liked. It’s my job to raise you right.” Dean’s voice was clearly proud when he said this, indicating it was typical, non-hypocritical behavior. When they met Max in 1×14, Sam said he was grateful that they didn’t grow up with a father that beat them.

So on what basis, exactly, could John have possibly gone on “drunken rages”, if he didn’t believe in getting wasted and didn’t physically abuse his sons?

Toni has fucked up intel before, massively, and it is a common tactic- especially on this show- to insult someone’s family to manipulate them and unbalance them. The fact that anyone believes what she’s saying is fucking beyond me.

Quick reminder, to the WRITERS IN PARTICULAR, that unless Toni was somehow fucking bugging all the Winchesters’ motel rooms, apartments, the Impala, all the paranoid and now-dead hunters’ places they stayed at, etc., she has no fucking idea what Sam and Dean’s childhood was actually like, what John was like behind closed doors.

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goyour-own-way:

baronsamediswife:

thegreyruin:

ambular-d:

angvlicmish:

It’s no wonder they’re damaged.

All true.  John was most certainly no Father of the Year.

But what Bevelli either didn’t know or wasn’t saying, is that when Sam was confronted with a hard-core, classically abusive father, he remarked on how much better he and Dean had it growing up, how much worse it could have been, and how well they turned out even with all of John’s shortcomings.  And Dean’s comment just a few episodes back:  “Next time you hear me say that our family is messed up, remind me that we could be psycho goat-people.”

I do hope Mary gets a chance to talk to the boys about it before she passes final judgement on John.  They’re the ones who have had to bear the consequences of his parenting their whole lives, and their opinions are the ones that count the most.

This breaks my heart. I’m not trying to pick a fight with anyone here but I think the hatred for John Winchester in this fandom has crossed all limits.
Again, not trying to pick a fight and honestly I am not going to reply to anyone trying to justify their hate to me. Because I’ve had this discussion a billion times and whatever you say will not change my opinion of him. I’d appreciate it though if you would hear me out once.
I’m not a John fan. I didn’t like him as such. But the way you guys punish him for not being able to win “father of the year” award, genuinely breaks my heart. Of course he wasn’t a great father. But did any of you pause to think that he is also a human, who is allowed to make mistakes and be human instead of being a perfect father? He had zero idea about this realm of supernatural and one unfortunate night he has to deal with the death of his wife, so bizarre that anyone could lose their mind. ANYONE. He probably did at some of the times, but trying his fucking best to make his sons able enough to fight the nasty and protect themselves as well as a zillion other people. Now is that such a huge crime that y’all would execute him if you could have?
The Winchesters were never normal and they were never ever going to be normal. So instead of just raising his sons, he also raised two amazingly kind as well as badass warriors because he knew something wasn’t right and it was never gonna be.
Now about Adam and baseball, John Winchester was a human. Humans have needs. I don’t think I need to elaborate here. But he is allowed to have another relationship, and another kid, and he is also allowed to make a decision to keep that other kid out of this supernatural drama. How is that so terrible?
He wasn’t the best parental figure around, but he did his job right enough considering the fucked up circumstances. Mary Winchester isn’t doing her job right even though she damn well could have. Now that’s a totally different discussion because in my honest opinion, the writers have made a mess of her character. It’s a lost opportunity.
Coming back to John Winchester, there’s one last thing I’d like to say. Team free will has done horrible things themselves, some even more horrible than John, but we’ll forgive them no matter what. Why? Because they’re the protagonists and they can’t be wrong? Why can’t you apply the same emotion with other characters? John sacrificed his life for his son irrespective of the fact that Azazel was still out there. John’s ultimate mission was to kill Azazel, so considering how TERRIBLE person he is, he should have just let his sons die right?
If you don’t agree with my opinions that’s absolutely fine. But can we minimise the hatred because seriously, he doesn’t deserve the amount of hate he gets.

And if you still wanna hate him, please also hate Sam for releasing the darkness who killed so many innocents throughout season 11, hate Dean for stopping his brother from closing the gates of hell for a selfish reason, hate Castiel for trying to be God and killing hundreds. If you can’t hate them, you have no right to hate John Winchester like you do.

I like this perspective and I also don’t want to join or start any fights about this debate.

I just finally realized why the rabid John hate makes me so incredibly uncomfortable.

Sam and Dean have both  both at various points in canon expressed love and positive feelings for their father. I feel like the debate not only punishes John but the boys (and by extension anyone who has  who has dealt with their conflicting feelings towards an abuser).

It is denying them the agency of their own perspective. Insisting that they and fandom in general need to hate John too denies the reality that human relationships IN REAL LIFE come in shades of grey. Not everyone is capable or willing to just cut toxic or abusive influences out of their lives because most relationships are not only ever one thing. And even if they do, they might STILL feel bad or sad or guilty about it.

The idea that hate is the only ‘good’ emotion allowed in this case is actually really awful. Is anyone who doesn’t feel that way a ‘bad’ victim then – or worse not a victim at all?

Yes! I’ve often felt the same way, because it seems like people are still looking for Sam and Dean to reject their father, and condemn the way he raised them, because it’s how they– the fans –feel, so they want Sam and Dean to feel the same way too.

But, the way I see it, we’ve seen them go through this process. Sam started out the show being very against his father, and not afraid to say so; even Dean, while he was initially defensive, has realized throughout the show that John was far from perfect. They’ve come to accept that, and– I think –have forgiven John for his mistakes, because they know firsthand how hard it is to always do the right thing (Dean, in particular, experienced just how hard when he was trying to figure out how to be a parent and protector of Ben).

They don’t have to hate their father in order to realize that their childhood was messed up. They know John wasn’t the best father, but they love him anyway, and they’ve moved on. Why can’t the fandom move on already? This idea that it’s John’s parenting that damaged Sam and Dean so irreversibly, not the horrible life they’ve led for the past 12 years, is just…. bizarre. But that’s another rant.